Pure Faith: A Bible Discussion Podcast

The Word of God in Scripture and the Mystery of the Burning Bush

February 20, 2024 Mitchell Heitkamp and Michele Waymire Episode 134
Pure Faith: A Bible Discussion Podcast
The Word of God in Scripture and the Mystery of the Burning Bush
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Have you ever considered the many ways God communicates with us? This episode peels back the layers of spirituality and faith, exploring the written, spoken, and most intriguingly, the manifest forms of the Word of God. We delve into the sacred texts of the Bible and then transition to the divine proclamations that shaped the very fabric of creation. But hold onto your seats, because we're not stopping at mere words; we're venturing into the tangible expression of the divine, with none other than Jesus Christ at the heart of the discussion. With insights from Dr. Michael Heiser's "The Unseen Realm," we uncover the rich tapestry of divine interaction woven throughout Scripture, offering you a new lens through which to view your spiritual journey.

Prepare for an eye-opening analysis of one of the most mystifying biblical events – Moses' encounter with the burning bush. Through this narrative, we trace the intricate intersections of God's presence and voice, and entertain the thought-provoking notion of Jesus as a precursor to his New Testament role. Our conversation, enriched by the groundbreaking perspectives from "The Unseen Realm," challenges conventional interpretations and invites you to engage with the scriptures on a deeper level. Join us as we navigate these complex themes, enhancing not only our understanding of the biblical texts but also our connection to the very essence of divine communication.

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Speaker 1:

So today our topic of discussion is going to be on the word of God, and that makes seem kind of vague or weird. What a lot of people don't realize is there's actually three different forms that the word of God will take, and so we're going to look at all three of them. The first two we're just going to kind of do a glance over, not going to go too deep into them. What I really want to focus in on is the third version of the word of God, because that's one that is seen the least. Even though it is seen throughout the Bible, it's just sometimes it doesn't always take a form that is clearly seen. So the first form of the word of God is the written word of God, and that is simply our Bibles. We know that God himself did not write the Bible, but we know that the Bible is made up of many different books it's actually a library of books that all the writings in the Bible were inspired by God. They were guided, the authors were guided through the writing or as they were writing, by the Holy Spirit to give the words that the Lord wanted to be given. So that is why the Bible is considered the word of God. The next one is the spoken word of God. Now, today's age, we don't hear God speaking to us ever. Anybody who does claim to hear the word of God, they're not actually hearing God. They're hearing Jesus. Jesus is the mediator between us and God. So when we do have some sort of sign or something like that and you hear somebody who had God speak to them, then that wasn't the Father God, that was the Son of God. But where we see the spoken word of God is in the written word of God. So we see it in the Bible, we see it in the words that God speaks. And the best example I have of this is something that I've covered with you in the past, and that is Genesis 1, the creation story. Because in the creation story God speaks, god says let there be light. Well, that's God speaking those words, and then it happens. So that is the spoken word of God and that happens all throughout the Old Testament especially, so it's not just unique to Genesis 1. But that is the spoken word of God. But now this third version, it's the manifestation of the word of God. And I realize for some people, michelle, manifestation and manifestation may be a large word, but it simply means that the word, a word, is a spoken word. It's not physical, it's not tangible. So for that to manifest, that means that word becomes man, it becomes something visible, it becomes something you can see, something you can interact with. So that's what it means by the manifestation of the word of God, and we actually do see this quite a bit in the Bible. It's just there are a lot of times where you don't see it or you overlook it.

Speaker 1:

And most of the information I'm getting for this comes from a single book. It's called the Unseen Realm by Dr Michael Heiser. Has anybody heard of this book or read this book? I highly recommend it. If you talk to me after church I can give you a link to it so you can get it. I'm not sure how much it costs. I say I read this book. I'm technically a liar because I listen to the book, because I do Audible, so I listen to books. It's easier for me. But I've actually listened to this book multiple times. I actually listened to most of it again this past week in preparation for this. But this book is very eye-opening and so a lot of this information is coming from there.

Speaker 1:

And so, going back to this idea of the word of God being a manifestation. Well, the first and the most popular place where we see this is in John 1.1. In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God and the word was God. So we know now, through a lot of theologians doing a study on this, that the word mentioned here is referring to Jesus. Now, it's really not that hard to figure out because if we actually go down to John 1.14, it says and the word became flesh and dwelt among us and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth. So John 1.14 clearly is mentioning this word of God coming down, manifesting as a baby and living among us here on earth. So this is, like I said, the most popular version of this manifestation of the word of God, but, like I said, it's not the only one. So one that most people don't realize or don't see is in Genesis 15.1 through 6.

Speaker 1:

And for you that don't know exactly what this is, this is where God comes down and makes the promise, the covenant with Abraham. Well, at that time it was Abraham that he was going to become a great nation. So I want to read this, and this reads After these things, the word of the Lord came to Abram and envisioned Fear not, abram, I am your shield. Your reward shall be very great. But Abram said oh Lord, god, what will you give me, for I continue childless and the heir of my house is Eleazar of Damascus. And Abram said Behold, you have given me no offspring and a member of my household will be my heir. And behold, the word of the Lord came to him. This man shall not be your heir, your very own son. Oops, sorry, your very own son. I lost my spot.

Speaker 2:

Oh, my goodness.

Speaker 1:

If you hold this too long, it goes into a different mode. Oh, where was I.

Speaker 1:

And behold, the word of the Lord came to him. This man shall not be your heir, your very own son shall be your heir. And he brought him outside and said Look toward heaven and number the stars. If you are able to number them. Then he said to him, so shall your offspring be. And he believed the Lord and he counted it to him as righteousness. So I don't know if you guys picked up on that. So it was the word of the Lord that came to Abram in a vision. So that has a couple of different implications, because if this was just literally a spoken word of the Lord, then why would it be in a vision? Why wouldn't they say and then the word of the Lord came to Abram, why does it have to be in a vision? The vision implies that something is being seen. So, okay, let's go down to the next step.

Speaker 1:

Well, now we hear Abram address the word of the Lord as Lord God. So he is giving this word of God a proper address for Lord God. Now Abram will go on and complain about how he doesn't have any kids. This Eleazar Damascus is going to inherit all this stuff. But after he gets done complaining, the word of the Lord takes him outside to show him the stars. Wow, to count the stars. It wasn't the word of the God, or the word of God told him to go outside and look at the stars. No, the word of the Lord came and took him outside Like there was a physical person. This word of God was a physical being that escorted Abram outside to go look at the stars, to count the stars. So this is implying that this word of God mentioned here, this isn't just a verbal word, this is a physical manifestation of the word of God. Well, if we take this back to John 1, john 1, 1, well, we know that the word of God represents Jesus. So now we can bring that back to here. So this word of God, even though this happened beforehand, we need to remember that Jesus is eternal. He was in the beginning. So Jesus was with God at this time. So this is a representation of Jesus coming down and speaking to Abram as a voice of God, telling Abram that you are going to be numerous people, you're going to have a son and you're going to be a father of nations. So I don't know if you guys are getting a full grasp of this. I mean, whenever I first heard this, it blew my mind. I'm like, are you being serious? Now? You know, you got to dig in and I got to see what they're actually talking about here. So this is saying that Jesus was here, he was working among the people before he became the son of God, born to Mary. Amen. But that's the thing. Now there are other parts, other times where Jesus is coming and interacting with the people, but first there's another example of the Word of God specifically being mentioned.

Speaker 1:

Now we are going to jump forward to an End Times type study. We're going to the book of Revelation. So in the book of Revelation, in Revelation 19, 11 through 13,. This reads Then I saw heaven opened and behold a white horse. The one sitting on it is called faithful and true and in righteousness he judges and makes war. His eyes are like a flame of fire and on his head are many diatoms and he has a name written that no one knows but himself. He is clothed in a robe dipped in blood and the name by which he is called is the Word of God. So this is clearly speaking of Jesus, and I only read verses 11 through 13 that we go on to verse 16. 16 is where this same rider on this white horse is called the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords, which we know that to be a somewhat well known saying for Jesus. So even though this does not specifically say it's Jesus, they give plenty of implications that it is referring to Jesus.

Speaker 1:

So now let's go back to another aspect of this whole Word of God, because I pointed out a couple different scenarios where Word of God is mentioned as a representation of a manifestation of Jesus, but that's not always the case. Jesus isn't always referred to as the Word of God. He also goes by other titles, and the other one that I really want to talk about is the Angel of God. Now we will see the Angel of God referred to many times in the Old Testament. Just like we seen the Word of God come to Abram and give that promise, well, we also see the Angel of God coming in doing the same thing. Again, there are many examples of this. Some of them are clear cut, easy to see. Some of them need to have a little more deeper study, and you've got to pair them up with other parts, so I don't want to go too deep into those weeds, but there is one that I think is as clear cut as the one with the Word of God coming to Abram, and that is in Exodus 3.1 through 6.

Speaker 1:

Now, this is the story of Moses going to the burning bush, so I want you to listen to this and see if you can catch it. It says Now Moses was keeping the flock of his father in the old Jethro, the priest of Minion, and he led his flock to the west side of the wilderness and came to Orem, the mountain of God, and the angel of the Lord appeared to him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush. He looked and behold, the bush was burning, yet it was not consumed. And Moses said I will turn aside to see this great site, why the bush is not burned. When the Lord saw that, he turned aside to see. God called to him out of the bush. Moses, moses. He said here I am. Then he said Do not come near, take your sandals off your feet, for the place on which you are standing is holy ground. And he said I am the God of your father, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face where he was afraid to look at God. So did you catch that?

Speaker 1:

So, as it opened up, it talked about how the angel of God was in the midst of the bush. But that was the only time the angel of God is mentioned, because after that, after Moses seized this bush off in the distance and seized that it's burning or it's on fire, but it doesn't look like it's burning up, moses like, hey, I won't go over there and take a look at this because this seems weird. So he goes over there. Well, at that point on, god is the one that speaks to Moses. God is the one that calls out of the middle of the bush and says Moses, moses, and then, from that point on it, it's gotten the voice, even says I am the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, the God of Jacob. So who's in this bush? Is it this angel of God? Is it God himself? Are they both in this bush? Well, my Answer or response to that, and simply be yes, because it's unclear, it would imply that the angel of God here, that is, is in the midst of this bush. That then has the voice of God. Well, there's only one person who could fulfill both of those rules as one being, and that would be Jesus, the son of God, Because, yes, he would be the angel of God, but then, at the same time, he would have the voice of God because he is God. So again, this is another Mind-blowing event here that again Jesus is coming to People on earth before he actually became the Jesus that we know, born of the Virgin Mary.

Speaker 1:

And you may be wondering, like why is this important? Why do we need to know this? Well, I can tell you for a fact that whenever I read that book on scene around and this came to me and I heard this, it completely opened my eyes to all the different, different nuances in the Bible that I didn't see before, and I think that this information could also help you find those Nuances that might give you help, give you another level of understanding when you are reading the Bible. And that is why I think this is important and I've been wanting to share this for probably years and I Just haven't done it because the Lord hasn't put it on my heart to do it, but did now. That's gonna scare me Like. So maybe that's the Lord saying hey, shut up, you're done. I Guess I shouldn't.

Speaker 2:

Have a time right. You have four minutes.

Speaker 1:

Well, now I'm completely lost. But yes, I do. I do think this, this information, could be very helpful and Really, I guess they have that really messed me up. I don't have anything else, so am I having questions for a bit? Could you repeat?

Speaker 2:

the name of that book.

Speaker 1:

It's called the unseen realm. Unseen, yes, and they talk. They talk about a lot of things in that book, but most of them I wouldn't be able to put into words because it goes into a lot of depth into, like Hebrew context and in Hebrew language and a bunch of different aspects that you would have to write a book in order to get your point across and I don't think I could do that here. But this one, I thought, was something that could be easily shared and understood the way Jesus, would you know.

Speaker 2:

I mean wait. So we talked to him before Jesus became Jesus. Call that the living word about it. Mm-hmm, it's alive because you've been still alive. It gives no, no. These ladies later feature here. What do they worship for Jesus?

Speaker 1:

Anybody else, one once or twice.

Forms of the Word of God
Moses and the Burning Bush Analysis