Speaker 1: 0:06

Hello and welcome to another episode of the Pure Faith Podcast, a podcast where we discuss all things Bible. I'm Michelle and this is Mitchell.

Speaker 2: 0:14

Hi, I did it different. I did it with my left hand this time.

Speaker 1: 0:17

We have the same clothes on as we did last time we do. We're doing another intro to one of the sermons that Mitchell gave at church at Living Waters Ministries. So, mitchell, some details on this one.

Speaker 2: 0:28

So this is. I did two back-to-back weeks pastors on vacation and so I kind of did a mini sermon series on baptism. But on the first week, as I typically do, I try to go a little off of mainstream is what I've been saying lately. And so I look at four words in the baptism story of Jesus, and that is Bethany across the Jordan.

Speaker 1: 0:59

Yeah, so you will get a geographical outline of Bethany and some other locations when it comes to Jesus' baptism.

Speaker 2: 1:09

Yes, and I didn't have PowerPoint for the actual sermon, but during this message I am hoping to put them in, so you'll have maps and you'll be able to see everything that I'm discussing and hopefully it makes sense.

Speaker 1: 1:23

Yeah, visuals really do help, so we appreciate that. So we do hope that you enjoy this sermon and we'll get to it.

Speaker 2: 1:33

Enjoy. Okay, I'm a little bit prepared for this. I know it was last time I was up here, so this should go a little bit smoother. You weren't even here last time, were you? No, it's louder, oh, louder, yes, okay, I'll you have to speak louder, oh louder, yes, okay, I'll try For this old lady.

Speaker 2: 1:51

Okay, so I have an interesting question here to start it off with. Have any of you ever been on a vacation and you're on a road trip, mainly and you see a town that has the same name as Versailles or similar name as the town around here? If we could just drive into that town and then somehow instantly be, go through a portal and come to that town name close to us.

Speaker 1: 2:34

Anybody else had that. Am I the only weird one? Yeah?

Speaker 2: 2:36

you're the weird one. So Paige and I were just recently up in New England and we were on our way home and I seen a sign for Troy, new Hampshire, and I was like, man, it'd be nice if we could just drive to Troy, new Hampshire, go through a tunnel of some sort and end up in Troy.

Speaker 1: 2:51

Ohio.

Speaker 2: 2:52

It would save me 12 hours of driving.

Speaker 2: 2:55

But unfortunately that doesn't work and I thought maybe somebody else would have that thought, but apparently I'm the only weirdo which is fine, I'm okay with that. Have that thought, but apparently I'm the only weirdo, which is fine, I'm okay with that. Um, but the one I'm trying to make is that there are multiple states that have towns that have the same name names as some of our towns. Um, in fact, there are 10 different states that have versailles as one of their towns or cities, and on top of that there's five other countries that have a city or town called Versailles, and some of those countries have multiple cities called Versailles, and that's just Versailles. We're just some little, small, little podunk town out in the middle of Ohio, but there's a lot of different Versailles all across this world. And do you realize what this means? Absolutely nothing, at least as far as the way we look at things today. It means nothing Unless there were portals that we could drive through to transport from town to town with the same names. That would be awesome, but we don't have that same names. That would be awesome, but we don't have that. So, unfortunately, for our modern day sense, it means nothing, but it does play a part in what we're going to be talking about today.

Speaker 2: 4:13

And today we'll be talking about the baptism of Jesus, so we'll be reading some scripture. Unfortunately I don't have the slides, so if you want to follow along, we'll be in Matthew 3, 13 through 17. And then we're also going to be in John's version, which will be John 1, 19 through 34. Although, just a little warning, I want to skip verse 24 in John, just because it's just a little additive and it disrupts the flow up to flow, so I'm going to skip over 24. So we're starting in Matthew 3, 13 through 17. And this reads Then Jesus came to Galilee, to the Jordan, to John, to be baptized by him.

Speaker 2: 4:59

John would have revented him, saying I need to be baptized by you and do you come to me? But Jesus answered him let it be so now, for thus it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness. Then he consented, and when Jesus was baptized, immediately he went up from the water and behold, the heavens were opened to him and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and coming to rest on him. He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and coming to rest on him and, behold, a voice from heaven said this is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased. So just a little bit of a little intro, or I don't know what you call it, before I read to the next in John's version. So, as we know, in scripture, after Jesus is baptized, he is then immediately taken off into the wilderness for the 40 days where he fasted 40 days, and he is tempted by the devil. And it's after he comes back in these 40 days that is where we are entering into John. So it may seem like it's all kind of happening quick, but there is that 40 days in there that Jesus was being tempted by the devil. So now in John 1, 19 through 34, after this I messed that up already and this is the testimony of John when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him who are you?

Speaker 2: 6:22

He confessed and did not deny, but confessed I am not the Christ. And they asked him what are you? He confessed and did not deny, but confessed I am not the Christ. And they asked him what then? Are you Elijah? He said I am not. Are you the prophet? And he answered no.

Speaker 2: 6:36

So they said to him who are you? We need to give an answer to those who sent us. What do you say about yourself? He said I am the voice of one crying out in the wilderness Make straight the way of the Lord, as the prophet Isaiah said.

Speaker 2: 6:50

They asked him then why are you baptizing if you are neither the Christ, nor Elijah, nor the prophet? John answered them I baptize with water, but among you stands one you do not know, even he who comes after me, the strap of whose sandal I am not worthy to untie. These things took place in Bethany, across the Jordan, where John was baptizing the next day, he saw Jesus coming toward him and said Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. This is he whom I said. After me comes a man who reigns before me, because he was before me. I myself did not know him, but for this purpose I came baptizing with water that he might be revealed to Israel. And John bore witness. I saw the Spirit descend from heaven like a dove, and it remained on him.

Speaker 2: 7:42

I myself did not know him but he who sent me to baptize with water said to me he on whom you see the Spirit descend and remain, this is he who baptizes with the Holy Spirit. And I have seen and have borne witness that this is the Son of God.

Speaker 2: 7:59

So, as you guys are probably well aware, whenever I come up here I tend to do things a little bit different. I kind of focus on different things, and things that I usually focus on are typically, oh, it's not the things that mainstream Christianity would necessarily focus on, and that's one of the reasons why I focus on them. I mean, I believe everything that mainstream Christianity says, but I also like to think outside the box a little bit, and I do that in order for all of us to kind of expand our thinking so we can kind of look at things in a different way, in a different light, just to kind of tweak something or trigger something in your minds. That way, when you're reading scripture on your own, you can kind of open up another door and see things in a deeper light. So I say that because I read all that scripture just to cover four words. Unless you're in the NIV, then it's eight words and that is Bethany across the Jordan and the NIV.

Speaker 2: 9:08

I think it is Bethany on the other side of the Jordan or something I don't know, but we're just going to focus today on this Bethany across the Jordan, as in. Where is it? What's significant about it? And all scholars agree that this Bethany across the Jordan is not the Bethany that is about two miles east-southeast of Jerusalem. That Bethany was the home of Mary, martha and Lazarus. Therefore, that was the location that Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead. Also, in that Bethany is where, if you remember, jesus was sitting at a table and I believe it was Mary came and anointed him with some very expensive oil. That happened at Simon the leper's house, which was in Bethany. And Bethany was a popular spot for people to stop because it was right in the main route, the traditional route, walking route from Galilee to Jerusalem. So whenever they go to Jerusalem for a feast or whatever, they'd typically be passing through Bethany or by Bethany. So Jesus would often retreat to Bethany. Whenever he was in Jerusalem for festivals, he would often retreat to Mary, martha and Lazarus' home and stay there a lot. So scholars believe that this Bethany, bethany across Jordan, that's not that Bethany. Well, why? Well, the simple reason is because of the addition of across the river.

Speaker 2: 10:46

That is what is known as a qualifier, and we actually see qualifiers a lot in the Bible. Most often it is they use qualifiers when you have multiple things with the same name. Most commonly is people's names. A lot of people's names have qualifiers behind them. For example, simon is often referred to as Simon Peter. Even though he may not get that name Peter, long after they're talking about Simon, they always call him Simon Peter, and the reason is it's a qualifier. Just like I was just talking about how Jesus was at Simon the leper's house, the leper is a qualifier. It's a way for them to distinguish different things apart from each other. We kind of use the same things nowadays but we use last names. So they didn't use last names. A lot of times back in those days they would say your first name and if you didn't have any other qualifier they would say the son of whoever, and that was what they used as a qualifier. So you know who exactly you were talking about. Well, and now we know that Bethany, home of Martha Mary Lazarus, and Bethany across the river are two different locations.

Speaker 2: 12:07

But that brings up the question where is that other Bethany of a history class? Because in third century there was a Bible scholar who wrote a commentary and this scholar's name was Origen and in that commentary he wrote well, when he was writing this commentary he was looking for this Bethany across the Jordan. All the manuscripts I can't talk today All the manuscripts that he had said that it was Bethany across the Jordan. They specifically said it was Bethany. But whenever he went to go find this Bethany across the Jordan he couldn't find any town or city or anything on the east side of the Jordan River called Bethany. So he kind of took it upon himself saying, well, straight, east of Jerusalem is a town called Bethabara. And he's like since I can't find any other Bethany, there's no other reference to this Bethany. It must be modern day Bethabara. So he changed the Bible and took out Bethany. It must be modern day Bethabara. So he changed the Bible and took out Bethany and said it was Bethabara across the river or across the Jordan. And if you have certain Bible translations it still has Bethabara in it. But all of modern day went back to Bethany, because all the old manuscripts and everything say it's Bethany across the Jordan.

Speaker 2: 13:43

But there, for a while, because of this third century scholar naming it Bethabara, a lot of people believe that it was this location that he decided was the location of Jesus' baptism. So there's something to know about this. Beth Bar, though Current day, beth Bar today. If you would go to that area, it's called Al-Maktus and it is a built-up place that has steps going down to the Jordan River. You could go there. You could go down into the water, like they have it built up saying this is where Jesus was baptized. Along with that, there are old ancient ruins. There's some old churches that they found there that have ruins. There are some other buildings in that area on both sides of the river.

Speaker 2: 14:33

The east side of the river now is the country of Jordan, which is kind of weird because you have the Jordan River and the country of Jordan. I got confused whenever. Weird because you have the Jordan River and the country of Jordan. I got confused whenever I was studying that for a little bit. Anyways, on the west side there are other ruins, but all these ruins are from the late 5th into the 6th century, throughout the 6th century. So all these ruins come after even Origen said that this was the location, which was the third century, but it all came even after Jesus was baptized.

Speaker 2: 15:06

So, yes, there's ruins there, but they came from such a later date. Were they there because that's where Jesus was baptized? Or is that because where origin said that the location was? We don't know. But this site is significant because at this Bethabara, this Elmactus, this is where the Israelites, where Joshua led the Israelites across the Jordan to go take Jericho whenever they were coming into the land of Canaan to take it over, this is where they crossed. This is also the location where Elijah and Elisha crossed over and Elijah was taken up into the whirlwind and then Elisha came back. So there is biblical significance in this area. But was it the place where Jesus was baptized? We don't know. Possibly, but we don't know.

Speaker 2: 16:00

Another big argument for this area of Bethabara being the place where Jesus was baptized comes from John 10, 40. So I'm actually going to read John 10, 39 through 42. And this reads again they and this they is the Jews from Jerusalem sought to arrest him and this him is Jesus. So you know what's actually going on here. So it says again they sought to arrest him, but he escaped from their hands. He went away again across the Jordan to the place where John had been baptized, had been baptizing at first, and there he remained and many came to him and they said John did no sign. So something to note about this particular passage is one it doesn't say that Jesus fled to Bethany across the Jordan. It just said Jesus fled across the Jordan. But it also doesn't say that this is where Jesus was baptized. It just said this is where John had been baptizing at first.

Speaker 2: 17:16

So I believe this actually works against their argument for Bethabara being the location of Jesus' actual baptism, because the way this is worded it implies that John didn't stay there. This is where John was baptizing at first, meaning there was second, third, fourth other places that John had gone to baptize. So this is just where John started his ministry baptizing, not where he stayed the entire time. So I think it works against that. But even with all that said, a lot of arguments against it, this could still be the place where Jesus was baptized, because we actually have no idea where it was. I want to say that a lot, because I need to emphasize that Some of the stuff I'm going to say it's my ideas, it's just ideas and it's just coming from me, so take it with a grain of salt. I forgot where I'm at here, so are there any other locations that has a history of claiming that Jesus was baptized there? And the answer is yes. There's actually multiple. The next most common one, or most believable one, I guess you'd say it's called Yardnit I don't know if I'm saying that right which is it's on the Jordan River, obviously, and it is south of the Sea of Galilee and it's about 60 miles north of the modern day Almactis. But there's something we need to know Bethabara. What does Bethabara actually mean? Bethabara actually means a place for a ford, a place of crossing a place to. It basically means some place where you can cross a river, and that's all it means. So Bethabara is a town name that's just a generic saying hey, this is a town where you can cross the river, but there are other places along the Jordan River that you can cross the river, that they have fords where you can cross the river. This Yardnit is one of them. But the bad part about this Yardnit is there's not much evidence. There's not much evidence. There's no ruins, there's no anything like that. It's just a place that is a possibility, and so a lot of people don't give it much credit for it. Because of that, and also because there was no third century scholar saying, hey, this is where Jesus was baptized country scholars saying, hey, this is where Jesus was baptized. I'm sure if Origen would have said it was there instead of Al-Maktus, then that other place probably would have had all the ruins and everything else that Al-Maktus has today. And there's another one that I was actually going to completely skip over, but I actually had a conversation with some of my army buddies this past week and they actually visited this site and I initially kind of ignored it or blew it off, because scripture obviously says that Jesus went to the Jordan to be baptized. Well, this location is no longer in the Jordan. It is a natural spring that feeds the Jordan, but what my army buddies were telling me that were there was. It is common knowledge for those who live in that area that where the Jordan River is now is not where it used to be, and it used to be so far to the east of where it is now and it was right where this natural spring was. And so at the time of Jesus' baptism, where this natural spring is today is where the Jordan River would have been in that day, and that's why they believe that that is the possible location of Jesus' baptism.

Speaker 2: 21:17

I haven't had much time to research that of Jesus' baptism. I haven't had much time to research that to know for sure, but it is something worth mentioning because, again, we don't know where Jesus was baptized. This is a possible location, but it still doesn't change where I believe the possible location is and that is it's. I have my reasons and I'll explain. So first to go back. Let's kind of recap a little bit before we go into my reasons for this location.

Speaker 2: 21:54

So back in the third century we had Origen, who changed Bethany to Bethabara because he couldn't find a Bethany across the Jordan, find a Bethany across the Jordan. Then we also had Bethany, or Bethabara, being a place of crossing. We have multiple places of crossing we have Almanac, we have Yarnet, but there's a third one, and it's actually north of the Sea of Galilee, that a lot of people don't give credit to. And this third one is in a region or a town, a region called Bethania. Some translations say Batania, but this is the ancient region of Bashan. So does that sound familiar from the last time I was up here? Because Bashan was where last time we talked about.

Speaker 2: 22:54

That's where Jesus took the disciples to Caesarea Philippi and where Jesus stood at what the ancient Israelites believed was the actual gates of Hades and made the proclamation he changed Simon's name from Simon to Peter, which means rock, and on this rock I will build my church and the gates of Hades will have no power over me. Where Jesus made this bold proclamation was at the base of Mount Hermon, who, at this cave that they believed was the actual, literal gates of Hades. This was also the location of Mount Hermon, which is where the Jordan River originates, on top of Mount Hermon is also where we have the beginning of the Genesis 6 paradigm, where we have the Watchers come down and the origin of the giants we also have. Mount Hermon is believed to be the most probable site of where the Transfiguration took place. What else happened to that region?

Speaker 2: 24:03

The region of Caesarea Philippi used to be known as Peneas, and Peneas was where they worshipped the goat man demon thing called Pan, which is where we get panicked from. So all this stuff happened in the same region, and now we have the possibility that there's a location up there where Jesus could have been baptized. And that kind of falls in line with all the other things that Jesus was doing up in that area, those strong proclamations that he was making, because remember, whenever Jesus went to Caesarea Philippi, that's where he made the statement that I am Christ, I am Messiah, I'm the Son of God and the gates of Hades will have no power over me. Remember the Transfiguration God speaks out and says this is my Son. What happens at the baptism? Heavens open up and God speaks this is my Son, with whom I am well pleased. So we have a lot of stuff that is very similar going on. And remember, jesus doesn't do anything by accident. Everything has a choice, everything has a purpose behind it. So it's very possible that, yes, it could have been up in this area of Bashan for that reason. However, that's not the reason. I think that's the area that Jesus was baptized, and the reason I think it is up there has nothing to do with that side of it. It has more to do with geography and chronology, as in the timeline of the Bible, how everything works. So let's take a little tangent here and look at the chronology. So again, given all those things that I just mentioned, that's not the reason. Sorry, I'm just kind of skimming through my notes trying to get caught up.

Speaker 2: 25:55

Alright, so going back to what we read at the beginning. So in Matthew we read the actual baptism. Okay, so after that baptism, jesus went to the wilderness. What better place to go to the wilderness than right next to the gates of hades, up, where all this evil and everything else is? It's a good place for the devil to be to tempt jesus, but it's a side note. Um, so jesus comes back from that temptation and now we would think, okay, he was out in the wilderness for 40 days, he's coming back. You would think he'd come back to the same area that he originally left for, as in where he was baptized at.

Speaker 2: 26:36

Well, that's where we get into John, and at the beginning of what I read, john's being questioned by these Levites and priests as in who are you, why are you baptizing all that other stuff? And John's, just like I'm just the one making the way straight for the Lord. And then it goes into the next day. And they said that took place at Bethany across the sorry Bethany across the Jordan. So now it says which. I don't think we read it Bethany across the Jordan. So now it says which. I don't think we read it. Yeah, we did so.

Speaker 2: 27:14

In the next day, john the Baptist sees Jesus and says Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. So to understand this chronology, this is going to be day zero, just so we know, as we get on, this will make more sense. So this is day zero, the day that John makes the proclamation that this is the name of the world, because on that first day, or that day zero is when John is saying basically we read that what happened with the baptism in Matthew. Now John is reiterating in past tense, saying that is what I've seen. But he goes a step further, saying when I seen that I didn't know who the Messiah was going to be, but the one who sent me to baptize. So God told him that whenever he sees the clouds open up and the spirit come down and rest on somebody, that was going to be basically the Messiah. And so now John is making that proclamation hey, I've seen this happen to this person. This is the son of God. So that was on day zero.

Speaker 2: 28:22

Then it says in scripture which we didn't read, this one, but it is in John 1.35, that's where it starts. It says the next day again, john sees Jesus and says behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. This time Andrew and John the apostle who would be the apostle was with him or next to him and heard this. They followed jesus. And now they're following jesus. They spent the rest of the day with jesus, listening to jesus, teach everything else, and they get excited about it and start following jesus.

Speaker 2: 28:59

Now we go to john 1, 43 to 44 again it says and this reads the next day, jesus decided to go to Galilee. He found Philip and said to him follow me. Now, philip was from Bethsaida, the city of Andrew and Peter. So Day zero, john made, john the Baptist made the proclamation. Hey, I seen this all happen. Now, day one would have been when Andrew and John followed Jesus. So now the next day will be day two, which is the day we're here, and it says Jesus decided to go back to Galilee. Well, what does that mean? I mean it's across the Jordan River, because if he's on the east side, he's not in Galilee. He was in Bethany or Bethania, however you want to say it. And now he's coming back into Galilee, into the yeah, back to Galilee. And in that process he comes across Philip and Nathaniel and said that they are from Bethsaida. Bethsaida is on the northeast corner of the Sea of Galilee. Now, technically, it's on the northeast corner of the Sea of Galilee. Now, technically, it's on the east side of the Jordan River. But it's not saying that he went to Bethsaida. He said that they were from Bethsaida, so they could have also been on the west side of the Jordan River. So so let me finish up before I get into why this all makes sense. So now we're getting into what Scripture says is no, I don't want that.

Speaker 2: 30:33

John 2, 1 and 2. And this says on the third day there was a wedding at Cana, in Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there. Jesus also was invited to the wedding with his disciples. So day zero John gave witness about Jesus. Day one Jesus called Andrew and John. Day two Jesus went back into Galilee and called Philip and Nathaniel. And now day three I think I did my fingers wrong, but day three is when Jesus is going to Cana to the wedding Day.

Speaker 2: 31:08

Three is when Jesus is going to Cana to the wedding. If Jesus was in Almactis in the southern part, just north of the Dead Sea, it would have been an over-affording trip just to get back to Cana, let alone pick up Nathaniel and Philip on the wedding. So yeah, it's stuff like that and there's other things along that same line the even with uh Yarnet it would have been better because he was already starting 60 miles North of of Amactus, but then again, getting it's possible. But what makes the most sense chronologically and geographically would be that if Jesus was baptized on the north side of the Galilee, next to or near the city of Bethsaida, near Cana, I mean it would all make sense that everything is up north, makes sense that everything is up north. So it doesn't have anything to do with the message that would be given if Jesus chose to be baptized up in that region. You know the message being given to the evil and everything else it's more about. Jesus couldn't walk that fast. I mean, to put it simply, that's a lot of miles to put in in a very short period of time If we take this order For what it is saying, you know, but he's been John's being very specific next day, next day, next day.

Speaker 2: 32:42

And remember John, the author who wrote the Gospel of John, that is the John that met with Jesus. He's the one that was with Andrew on day one. So John was there for all of this. So I kind of give credit to the fact that John knew what day was what and what happened on each day if he was with Jesus throughout all of that, what and what happened on each day if he was with Jesus throughout all of that. So something else I want to talk about is the fact of whenever you read a lot of commentaries and stuff, it feels like they believe John the Baptist, just like this is where he's baptizing and that's it, like he didn't move, like that that's just where he did his baptizing. But that's not true. That's not true at all. Like I read in early on, you know that's where when Jesus went across the Jordan, that's where John first did his baptizing. John, I did his baptizing. But we also see in John 3.23 that John was baptizing at Anon, near Silene.

Speaker 2: 34:00

Well, I firmly believe that John baptized at all these locations. He baptized up and down the Jordan River. He went to other locations besides the Jordan River. His ministry wasn't confined to one small area, he traveled. So it's very possible that, yes, even though maybe Jesus did get baptized up in the north, but that doesn't mean John the Baptist wasn't up there baptizing he could have been baptizing at Yarden. He could have been baptizing at Al-M baptizing. He could have been baptizing at Yarden. He could have been baptizing at Halmaktos. He could have been baptizing at Aenon near Selim. He could have been all these places plus many more.

Speaker 2: 34:34

So, just like Jesus, we shouldn't limit John's ministry to one area. We need to think that, yes, he probably moved around, he spread his message. I mean, that's the way I look at it. But just to again summarize, a lot of this is just my thoughts and opinions, just the way I just this is the way I feel led. Whenever I'm reading this kind of stuff, I try to think of it logically and what makes sense, how things would work in real life. And it just makes sense to me that Jesus would be baptized north and not south, especially after learning that the whole idea of the south just came from one third-century scholar who couldn't find the actual Bethany across the river. So it's taking your food for thought, something to think about, something to hopefully open your minds as you're reading your scripture that maybe everything's not what everybody has always said it is, and that there's a lot more to scripture than just the words on the page.

Speaker 1: 35:41

Thank, you What'd you think? I thought it was interesting. It it was interesting, it was very interesting and we did learn a lot about the location and just different locations. You didn't talk about just one, you didn't talk about Bethany. You showed us that there could have been so many and really, when it comes to the last location that you talk about, I think that was the moment for me that I thought that could be really truly where it was. Yeah, and I don't know. None of us know. We don't know.

Speaker 2: 36:15

But that was the big thing I was trying to get across is yeah, that's my opinion and that kind of makes sense for me. It does make a lot of sense, but at the end of the day, we still don't know.

Speaker 1: 36:25

No, no and it doesn't matter, no it doesn't matter. But we hope you enjoyed the sermon. I know I learned a lot from it. Just to have Mitchell's you know the way he takes it and goes beyond just scripture with it, and to give us more information and background. I appreciate that as well. So we hope you enjoyed it as much as what we did and we thank you again for joining us.

Speaker 2: 36:46

Have we did and we thank you again for joining us. Have a blessed day everybody.